I have just read a piece in The Epoch Times which adds more reason for skepticism of the Democratic inquisition of Trump. Related to a meeting in Washington in April of 2016 (prior to the 2016 election): “Events detailed in an April 25 article by investigative reporter John Solomon, who quoted firsthand witnesses to report that Ukrainian officials who attended the White House meeting were encouraged to reopen an investigation involving the chairman of the Trump campaign (Manafort) and stand down from an investigation into Burisma.” It appears that the Democrats may have used the Ukraine to interfere in the 2016 election. Does anyone wonder why Trump might want the new Ukrainian government to investigate that? Does anyone think that it is wrong for Trump to want to investigate that?
On to the phone conversation:
I have taken the conversation, which is available in PDF at many different websites including CNN, and other propaganda outlets of the progressive socialist movement, as well as real news sites. I believe they all are the same. I was able to turn one into text format, which made it useable in Word. Here are some links where you can see the original full PDF:
In my annotation, all of my notes are bold and enclosed within . Those that are not bold, nor enclosed, were part of the original report. Here it is:
MEMORANDUM OF TELEPHONE CONVERSATION:
CAUTION: A Memorandum of a Telephone Conversation: (TELCON) is not a verbatim transcript of a discussion. The text in this document records the notes and recollections of Situation Room Duty Officers and NSC policy staff assigned to listen and memorialize the conversation in written form as the conversation takes place. A number of factors can affect the accuracy of the record, including poor telecommunications connections and variations in accent and/or interpretation.
[NOTE: I’m not sure if the Schiff inquisitors are using the above statements as justification to declare the transcript is fudged, but given the number of note takers, some of which were holdover Obama operatives, I think any inconsistency would have been rectified before this was released.]
The President: Congratulations on a great victory. We all watched from the United States and you did a terrific job. The way you came from behind, somebody who wasn’t given much of a chance, and you ended up winning easily. It’s a fantastic achievement. Congratulations.
President Zelensky: You· are absolutely right Mr. President. We did win big and we worked hard for this. We worked a lot but I would like to confess to you that I had an opportunity to learn from you. We used quite a few of your skills and knowledge and were able to use it as an example to win our elections and yes, it is true that these were unique elections. We were in a unique situation that we were able to achieve a unique success. I’m able to tell you the following: The first time you called me to congratulate. me when I won my presidential election, and the second time you are now calling me when my party won the parliamentary election. I think I should run more often so you can call me more often and we can talk over the phone more often.
The President: [laughter] That’s a very good idea. Think your country is very happy about that.
President Zelensky: Well yes, to tell you the truth, we are trying to work hard because we wanted to drain the swamp here in our country. We brought in many, many new people. Not the old politicians, not the typical politicians, because we want to have a new format and a new type of government. You are a great teacher for us and in that.
[NOTE: While it is expected that Zelensky would butter the President up, one must note that there are some commonalities between the Ukrainian election (drain the swamp syndrome) and the election of Donald Trump. Oddly, the corrupt situation in the Ukraine seems much more real to many of us in the US than our own, yet we know many in the political establishment have made vast fortunes while working as relatively low paid (in terms of people who become multi-millionaires) salaries. Their government salaries and their net worths do not mesh. Often they have husbands or spouses who run businesses from which they attribute their wealth, but when those businesses have lucrative contracts with foreign countries, one can’t help but wonder. With Trump we don’t have to wonder; he was already rich. it’s the ultra-rich public “servants” whom we need to wonder about.
In any case, there is a commonality between Trump’s election and Zelensky’s even if Zelensky was just playing to Trump’s ego.]
The President: Well it is·very nice of you to say that. I will say that we do a lot for Ukraine. We spend a lot of effort and a lot of time. Much more than the European countries are doing and they should be helping you more than they are. Germany does almost nothing for you. All they do is talk and I think it’s something that you should really ask them about. When I was speaking to Angela Merkel she talks Ukraine, but she doesn’t do anything. A lot of the European countries are the same way so I think it’s something you want to look at, but the United States has been very, very good to Ukraine. I wouldn’t say that it’s reciprocal necessarily because things are happening that are not good but the United States has been very, very good to Ukraine.
[NOTE: Here Trump does two things 1) Reminds Zelensky that we are their greatest financial supporters, 2) Pushes Zelensky to pressure the EU for more help which we will soon learn was key to us issuing the last round of aid.
Some of the State Department folks, particularly the Obama holdovers might view the reference to the EU to be destabilizing to our relationship with Germany and Merkel. I think it is not. It is consistent with Trump’s EU position, which if the EU sub-nations don’t know by now, then they need to wake up.
There is also a slight reference to there being a problem for the US in the Ukraine. It’s nature is not stated yet.]
President Zelensky: Yes, you are absolutely right. Not only 100%, but actually 1000% and I can tell you the following; I did talk to Angela Merkel and I did meet with her. I also met and talked with Macron, and I told them that they are not doing quite as much as they need to be doing on the issues with the sanctions. They are not enforcing the sanctions. They are not working as much as they should work for Ukraine. It turns out that even though logically, the European Union should be our biggest partner but technically the United States is a much bigger partner than the European Union and I’m very grateful to you for that because the United States is doing quite a lot for Ukraine. Much more than the European Union especially when we are talking about sanctions against the Russian Federation. I would also like to thank you for your great support in the area of defense. We are ready to continue to cooperate for the next steps; specifically we are almost ready to buy more Javelins from the United States for defense purposes.
[NOTE: It seems clear right here that Zelesky expects military aid, and has no idea about any strings being attached. Also that he has already received some aid (the word “more” in italics). He doesn’t hint at any prior agreement or discussion along those lines. It appears that Adam Schiff and the leading Democrats have poor reading comprehensive to have missed this key point.]
The President: I would like you to do us a favor though because our country has been through a lot and Ukraine knows a lot about it. I would like you to find out what happened with this whole situation with Ukraine, they say Crowdstrike. I guess you have one of your wealthy people. The server, they say Ukraine has it. There are a lot of things that went on, the whole situation I think you’re surrounding yourself with some of the same people. I would like to have the Attorney General call you or your people and I would like you to get to the bottom of it. As you said yesterday, that whole nonsense ended with a very poor performance by a man named Robert Mueller, an incompetent performance, but they say a lot of it started with Ukraine. Whatever you can do, it’s very important that you do it if that’s possible.
[NOTE: So now we have something of a request, but nothing in the above can be called a demand, nor a quid pro quo (and if it were, then it is justified), and because there has been absolutely no mention of paying Zelensky to do anything illegal, it cannot be considered a bribe.
What can we say about it? We know Trump has suffered for over two years under an investigation which had false roots coming out of the Steele Dossier. Therein Trump was accused with colluding with Russians to defeat Hillary in our national election. Ironically, it is beginning to appear that the Russian’s fed disinformation on Trump to the Clinton Campaign, this disinformation was then funneled to the FBI. We know that the FBI used this false information to obtain warrant to spy on Trump’s campaign and perhaps into his presidency. Lately it has been coming to the surface that the Ukraine (the Ukraine at the time had a Russia friendly president) might have been involved in the disinformation process. This muck may clear up some in the next few weeks when the reports from the Attorney General’s Office come out.
In any case, the above spying by the party in power against the opposition party is the anti-thesis of the principles of a democratic nation, and it smacks of totalitarian police state machination. Talk about damaging to the USA! This situation is magnitudes more dangerous to our democratic system than anything Trump thought about doing with the Ukraine.
Of course, Trump grabbed onto this one, which was the right thing to do. He should not drop it. It is and was he duty to not drop It, because this kind of police state machination should NOT happen in this country. It is also clear that anyone in the USA who had anything to do with it would NOT want it ever to be investigated.
Could that be the whole reason the Democrats are in such of an uproar? They don’t want anyone to ever investigate the sources of that disinformation campaign?]
President Zelensky: Yes, it is very important for me and everything that you just mentioned earlier. For me as a President, it is very important and we are open for any future cooperation. We are ready to open a new page on cooperation in relations between the United· States and Ukraine. For that purpose, I just recalled our ambassador from United States and he will be replaced by a very competent and very experienced ambassador who will work hard on making sure that our two nations are getting closer.
I would also like and hope to see him having your trust and your confidence and have personal relations with you so we can cooperate even more so I will personally tell you that one of my assistants spoke with Mr. Giuliani just recently and we are hoping very much that Mr. Giuliani will be able to travel to Ukraine and we will meet once he comes to Ukraine. I just wanted to assure you once again that you have nobody but friends around us.
[Every US administration changes some diplomatic staff, but probably not all. Trump left some Obama holdovers in place anticipating that they would behave professionally and dutifully implement Trump’s policies, just like one would expect subordinates to do in a business, i.e. you do what the new boss asks. Regrettably, some of the Obama holdovers have a different view of the world. Several have spoken against Trump in the impeachment hearings basically saying his crime was not adhering to THEIR foreign policy, particularly in the Ukraine. The main point here is that Zelensky seems to have the same problem with hold over diplomats. Of course, he is replacing people who were put in their positions by a corrupt government. So we understand why he wants to replace them. Is it possible that Trump is in some part doing the same thing, replacing people put in place by a corrupt government?]
I will make sure that I surround myself with the best and most experienced people. I also wanted to tell you that we are friends. We are great friends and you, Mr. President, have friends in our country so we can continue our strategic partnership. I also plan to surround myself with great people and in addition to that investigation, I guarantee as the President of Ukraine that all the investigations will be done openly and candidly. That I can assure you.
[So is Zelesky implying that in the past things have been done below the boards? In any case he expects all initiatives done during his administration to be above board and that the public will be informed.]
The President: Good because I heard you had a prosecutor who was very good and he was shut down and that’s really unfair. A lot of people are talking about that, the way they shut your very good prosecutor down and you had some very bad people involved. Mr. Giuliani is a highly respected man. He was the mayor of New York City, a great mayor, and I would like him to call you. I will ask him to call you along with the Attorney General. Rudy very much knows what’s happening and he is a very capable guy. If you could speak to him that would be great. The former ambassador from the United States, the woman, was bad news and the people she was dealing with in the Ukraine were bad news so I just want to let you know that.
[So again, it is clear that Trump is using Giuliani because he trusts him and Trump does not trust the entrenched State Department staff who may include Obama holdovers. It is not illegal, nor unprecedented; FDR did it. In many cases these holdovers have been recalcitrant ideologues and have worked against him while working within his administration. He had nothing good to say about Yovanovitch; who, in return, had nothing good to say about him when she testified before the impeachment hearings. At this point, the impeachment hearings are shaping up to be another resistance effort to forestall the president from achieving his goals. I.e. for them it is a win-win: Either they convince the public that he must be removed and he is removed, or they simply fell another oak tree across his path and he has to stop and remove it- then they move on to find another to fell across the road.]
The other thing, there’s a lot of talk about Biden’s son, that Biden stopped the prosecution and a lot of people want to find out about that so whatever you can do with the Attorney General would be great. Biden went around bragging that he stopped the prosecution so if you can look into it. It sounds horrible to me.
[Finally the Biden’s are invoked, but in reference to Joe Biden stopping the investigation of Hunter Biden. So is the issue with the Democrats that it is illegal to investigate a fishy situation that involves a Democratic candidate, because they have already tacitly approved of such investigations when they had the FBI spy on candidate Trump during the 2015-16 campaign, but they used falsified premises to initiate that investigate. They have no room to complain, given that the Russia collusion was a made up situation and the Biden situation is indeed fishy.]
President Zelensky: I wanted to tell you about the prosecutor. First of all, I understand I’m knowledgeable about the situation. Since we have won the absolute majority in our Parliament; the next prosecutor general will be 100% my person, my candidate, who will be approved, by the parliament and will start as a new prosecutor in September. He or she will look into the situation, specifically to the company that you mentioned in this issue. The issue of the investigation of the case is actually the issue of making sure to restore the honesty so we will take care of that and will work on the investigation of the case. On top of that, I would kindly ask you if you have any additional information that you can provide to us, it would be very helpful for the investigation to make sure that we administer justice in our country. With regard to the Ambassador to the United States from Ukraine as far as I recall her name was Ivanovicli. It was great that you were the first one who told me that she was a bad ambassador because I agree with you 100%. Her attitude towards me was far from the best as she admired the previous President and she was on his side. She would not accept me as a new President well enough.
[So Zelensky says they will only do honest investigating and that it is important to his people that they do so. No more corruption. It is interesting that he points out his problems with holdovers from the previous Ukraine administration, and that the previous Ambassador to the US was “an admirer of the previous Ukraine president”. That president had Russian ties and was viewed as corrupt, and she was his choice to represent the Ukraine to the Obama Administration- Interesting? Should that arrangement also be investigated?]
The President: Well, she’ s going to go through some things. I will have Mr. Giuliani give you a call and I am also going to have Attorney General Barr call and we will get to the bottom of it. I’m sure you will figure it out. I heard the prosecutor was treated very badly and he was a very fair prosecutor so good luck with everything. Your economy is going to get better and better I predict. You have a lot of assets. It’s a great country. I have many Ukrainian friends, they’re incredible people.
[Clearly Trump is still hung up on the previous prosecutor and how Biden interfered with his investigations. Because the potential improprieties in the Ukraine, both election interference and the Biden involvement with Burisma, are tied to the US issues of potential corruption and illegal involvement in an election, Trump is saying that Barr will want to be in the loop, and until both of those situations are proven to be clean, I think we need to be involved. Again the Democrats have already justified this by their own actions.]
President Zelensky: I would like to tell you that I also have quite a few Ukrainian friends that live in the United States. Actually, last time I traveled to the United States, I stayed in New York near Central Park and I stayed at the Trump Tower. I will talk to them and I hope to see them again in the future. I also wanted to thank you for your invitation to visit the United States, specifically Washington DC. On the other hand, I also want to ensure you that we will be very serious about the case and will work on the investigation. As to the economy, there is much potential for our two countries and one of the issues that is very important for Ukraine is energy independence. I believe we can be very successful and cooperating on energy independence with United States. We are already working on cooperation. We are buying American oil but I am very hopeful for a future meeting. We will have more time and more opportunities to discuss these opportunities and get to know each other better. I would like to thank you very much for your support.
The President: Good. Well., thank you very much and I appreciate that. I will tell Rudy and Attorney General Barr to call. Thank you. Whenever you would like to come to the White House, feel free to call. Give us a date and we’ll work that out. I look forward to seeing you.
[Clearly the president hopes that the Ukraine will work with our justice departure to determine if there was foreign intervention (Crowdstrike) in the 2016 US election.]
President Zelensky: Thank you very much. I would be very happy to come and would be happy to meet with you personally and I get to know you better. I’m looking forward to our meeting and I also would like to invite you to visit Ukraine and come to the city of Kiev which is a beautiful city. We have a beautiful country which would welcome you. On the other hand, I believe that in September l will be in Poland and we can meet in Poland hopefully. After that, it might be a very good idea for you to travel to Ukraine. We can either take my plane and go to Ukraine or we can take your plane, which is probably much better than mine.
[Basically a bunch of mutual backslapping and flattery.]
The President: Okay, we can work that out. I look forward to seeing you in Washington and maybe in Poland because I think we are going to be there at that tlme.
President Zelensky: Thank you very much Mr. President.
The President: Congratulations on a fantastic job you’ve done. The whole world was watching. I’m not sure it was so much of an upset but congratulations.
Zelensky: Thank you Mr. President bye-bye.
End of Conversation
[End NOTE: Did either Trump or Zelensky imply that military aid was being withheld contingent on Ukraine investigating Biden? No, in fact, from Zelensky’s comment it appears that some military aid had already transferred (see bold italics in text above). Was Trump interested in the Ukraine undertaking an investigation of suspected US-Russia-Ukrainian attempt to sabotage the US 2016 election. Of course he is; he was the target of the sabotage. And also he is interested in whether Biden used his position to get his son hired into a high paying position with a Ukrainian company. Of course he is. The Democrats have dug up, dragged out, and created anything they could to taint Trump; if Biden truly did something corrupt, Trump would naturally want to find it out. Lastly, it is in the best interest of the USA and the American people that Trump encourage the Ukrainians to look into these things. If indeed either is correct, we the people need to know about it, and if both are myths, we need to know that too. There is nothing illegal or improper about INVESTIGATING possibly subversive activities. On the other hand, the misuse of the US governmental agencies to CREATE a false narrative against a opposite candidate is illegal, Soviet-like authoritarian, and anti-democratic.]